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PA2AGA > TCPDIG 20.07.97 18:53l 110 Lines 4562 Bytes #-10285 (0) @ EU
BID : TCP_97_53B
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Subj: TCP-Group Digest 97/53B
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Date: Sun, 20 Jul 97 11:38:23 MET
Message-Id: <tcp_97_53B>
From: pa2aga
To: tcp_broadcast@pa2aga-1
Subject: TCP-Group Digest 97/53B
X-BBS-Msg-Type: B
Charles Brabham wrote:
> In effect, there IS NO amateur tcp/ip "network".. Just a series of
> isolated, insulated LANS with NO amateur tcp/ip generated connectivity..
> That is, other networks such as the Internet must provide a simulation of
> connectivity which doesn't exist in reality.
Charles,
As much as I hate to perpetuate this fairly pointless and very wasteful
debate, I agree with you. But I'm not sure you're making the point you
think you are. I have a question for you, why isn't there one ?
My own observations suggest the following (sweeping generalisation alert):
1> tcpip is of interest to computing oriented hams rather than radio
oriented hams.
2> computing oriented hams tend not to be full calls, rather they tend
to be limited (I think you call it technician class in the US?) class
licenses.
3> The radio oriented hams interested in packet radio, while having some
interest in computing, have a limited range of skill in computing.
The end result of this, I believe, is exactly what we see today.
The computer weenies whining because the radio weenies won't use
decent protocols or won't experiment with better protocols. The radio
weenies whining that the computer weenies don't have a 'network'.
The computer weenies saying "you don't know what a network is".
The radio weenies saying "I can get my mail anywhere in the world
completely by radio". The computer weenies saying "yes, thats exactly
what we mean when we say you don't know what a network is" and this
horrible dichotomy continuing to be perpetuated by fruitless
discussion.
I've long wished that I could find a truly radio oriented ham to work
with on the sorts of packet networking projects I envision.
I'm personally a little bit of a generalist, meaning I'm not superskilled
in either camp, but I'm slowly leaning toward computing more heavily.
I'd love to have a hard radio engineer to work with, someone who wouldn't
be daunted by the thought of building/modifying a radio capable of
some high speed packet, or antenna construction.
In Australia it isn't even legal for me to be digitally routed or repeated
onto H.F., so H.F. holds very limited interest to me. Therefore if I think
packet network I think VHF, UHF where the radio techniques are so much
more complicated. I can't be a master of all arts. (any ? :)
There is bugger all sense of community in amateur radio these days.
Not only do I find people aren't interested in helping, more often than
not I find those with the skills I need in a team are actively working
against me. So I end up working with what I have, and if that means
that I use radio where radio is easy to use (local area networks)
and other technologies to bridge the gaps then I do that with a free
and clear conscience. I'd be overjoyed for someone to approach me and
suggest that a Sydney/Canberra link should be built with radio
infrastructure "would I help ?".
I want a radio based data network as much as anybody, it's been a dream
of mine for nearly a decade. But I don't have sufficient hard radio
skills to answer all of the questions that need answering, nor do I
have the time to go and learn them. There is an economy of scale issue
for me, I work in the computing industry, learning computing related
skills works for both parts of my life and is therefore the most
efficient thing for me to learn.
I've recently taken a step back and thrown some support toward the Rose
protocol. In NSW the Rose Network offers what I see as the last hope
of any promise. It's a compromise for me, but that's ok, I can do that.
regards
Terry
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End of TCP-Group Digest V97 #53
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