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ZL3AI > APRDIG 24.10.03 20:38l 256 Lines 9284 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Subj: TAPR Digest, Oct 22, 4/5
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From: ZL3AI@ZL3VML.#80.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Subject: Re: run time a car battery....
From: James Washer <washer@trlp.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 13:41:13 -0700
X-Message-Number: 24
I have to question this.. In my experience, automotive alternators are
pretty dumb devices. Essentially voltage regulated power supplies. They
will do whatever they can to keep the voltage constant. Obviously, they can
only supply so much current.
I don't believe they have two modes, on to replace the charge lost in
starting and another to 'maintain' the batteries.
The battery at the lowest voltage will take more current given the constant
voltage ( limited by the batteries internal series resistance ).
Here's a potential risk of using the cars charging system to recharge a
HEAVILY depleted deep cycle battery. With a 100++ Amp alternator, sitting
at ~14 volts.. Will the charge current to a 'dead' deep cycle battery
exceed the C/20 charge current limit?
- jim
p.s. And to think people thought the Anderson Power Pole thread lived to
long!
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Subject: Re: ultimate in-line fuse holder
From: "Chuck KA0WFI" <chuck@brewventure.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 14:06:21 -0700
X-Message-Number: 25
Although their home site seems to be down at this moment, you might want to
google the following:
"posi-lock" or "swenco products"
There are various configurations, with and w/o fusing, various size wiring
etc.
I use them and find them an excellent product.
73
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Subject: Re: run time a car battery....
From: "Daron J. Wilson" <daron@wilson.org>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 14:31:53 -0700
X-Message-Number: 26
>I have to question this.. In my experience, automotive alternators are pretty
>dumb devices. Essentially voltage regulated power supplies. They will do
>whatever they can to keep the voltage constant. Obviously, they can only
>supply so much current.
>
>Idon't believe they have two modes, on to replace the charge lost in starting
>and another to 'maintain' the batteries.
I don't believe it is a mode as much as it is the exciter voltage from
the battery. As it was explained to me multiple times by the auto
electric places, the alternator charges based on that exciter voltage
from the battery. When that exciter voltage is relatively high (seeing
the starter battery) it won't provide the charge necessary to bring up
the deep cycle battery that is partially depleted. I know there is a
difference depending on the type of alternator, but that how it was
explained to me. That was the reason that paralleling the batteries
together with a relay never seemed to get my deep cycle up to where it
should be. Of course, I could be wrong, but that's what I remember the
guy explaining to me.
Since then I've done the isolator thing and NEVER had a problem with it.
73 N7HQR
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Subject: Re: run time a car battery....
From: "Spider" <spider@rivcom.net>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 14:58:43 -0700
X-Message-Number: 27
From: "Tyler Allison" <tyler@allisonhouse.com>
To: "TAPR APRS Special Interest Group" <aprssig@lists.tapr.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2003 11:21 AM
Subject: [aprssig] Re: run time a car battery....
>Generally the toughest part is finding a good way to mount the second
>battery pan in the engine compartment.
naw, Remove the passenger seat, install radios. Remove rear seat,
instal....never mind
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Subject: Re: run time a car battery....
From: James Washer <washer@trlp.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:15:13 -0700
X-Message-Number: 28
Hmmm,
How could the alternator know the difference between a discharged deep
cycle battery and your headlights being on? Both are just 'resistive' loads
to your alternator. The alternator detects the voltage 'drag' of the load,
by seeing the voltage drop. It increases it's field current ( via it's
internal voltage regulator (most/many alternators are now 'one wire design
)) to push more current into the system until the overall voltage is at the
regulated level.
I just cannot believe the alternator will do anything other than charge the
discharged deep cycle (perhaps at TOO HIGH a current)
I too.... could be wrong..
- jim
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Subject: SMART digi paths
From: Bob Bruninga <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 18:21:08 -0400 (EDT)
X-Message-Number: 29
I am going to add the smart-digi path directives to my new-paradigm web
page but want to make sure I have all of them. These directives are
placed at the end of a digi path as a directive to any smart digis or
igates that may hear the packet.
NOGATE - IGates should igonre these packets
RFONLY - IGates should ignore these packets (why do we have 2?)
IGATE - Smartdigi may substitute shortest path to nearest IGate
ISTATE - Smartdigi may substitute a LINKn-N along an interstate
LAN - Smartdigi may substitute local LANn-N name
LINK - Smartdigi may substitute an optimum LINKn-N path
EOC - Smartdigi may substitute shortest path to nearest EOC
SKYWRN - Smartdigi may substitute preferred skywarn path
WX - Smartdigi may substitute preferred local WX path
NOAUTO - Smartdigi may do NOTHING to this path
Of the above, I dont see the general value of the LINK directive, but I
included it just for completeness. Below are the Directives that I am not
including:
LOCAL - Meaningless. All APRS packets are supposed to be local
WORLD - Meaningless. ALL APRS packets are supposed to be global
via the APRS-IS.
REGION - Replaced with "LAN" under the new paradigm.
Did I forget any?
de WB4APR, Bob
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Subject: Re: run time a car battery....
From: "Mike Yetsko" <myetsko@insydesw.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 18:24:45 -0400
X-Message-Number: 30
>Hmmm,
>
>How could the alternator know the difference between a discharged deep
>cycle battery and your headlights being on? Both are just 'resistive'
>loads to your alternator. The alternator detects the voltage 'drag' of the
>load, by seeing the voltage drop. It increases it's field current ( via
>it's internal voltage regulator (most/many alternators are now 'one wire
>design )) to push more current into the system until the overall voltage
>is at the regulated level.
>
>I just cannot believe the alternator will do anything other than charge
>the discharged deep cycle (perhaps at TOO HIGH a current)
>
>
>I too.... could be wrong..
>
> - jim
Well, I had to put an alternator in my sons car (92 Olds). The thing
came with a warning that if it was installed in a vehicle with a dead or
extremely low battery it would damage the alternator and the warranty
would be void.
I'll look for the slip and see if I can find the exact wording.
Mike
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[commercial content deleted]
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Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Solar Panel damage
From: <BobDonnell@arkalmus.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 16:02:59 -0700
X-Message-Number: 32
Hi Bob,
It occurs to me too that if you have access to the internals of the
panel, you ought to be able to put a diode in parallel with each cell,
that will prevent excessive reverse voltage on any single cell in a
series array, preventing the heat build-up and lost power output from
that panel. With some of the intelligent, switching supply based,
charge controllers out there, loss of a single cell wouldn't cause the
panel total power output to fall as much, either.
73, Bob, KD7NM
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Subject: Re: SMART digi paths
From: "Bill Vodall - WA7NWP" <wa7nwp@jnos.org>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2003 16:31:31 -0700
X-Message-Number: 33
> Below are the Directives that I am not including:
>
>LOCAL - Meaningless. All APRS packets are supposed to be local
No. This means local only. Essentially one digi hop. The "30 second"
packet from the mobile. All packets are indeed local, but local packets
aren't all packets.
This is probably unnecessary and is equivalent to a simple "RELAY". Using
the pseudo alias in addition to relay has the advantage that it can be
adjusted by the local network operators. In area starved for activity,
LOCAL may be two digi hops.
>WORLD - Meaningless. ALL APRS packets are supposed to be global
> via the APRS-IS.
APRS-IS is not a conern for the RF user UNLESS they purposely want
their transmissions to go to the IGATE. This is a RF path. Maybe WORLD
is too big of a term. What is meant is the maximum acceptable RF path.
>REGION - Replaced with "LAN" under the new paradigm.
Different name with essentially the same meaning. I'd suggest that
sending a transmission to cover the current REGION is more descriptive then
covering the LAN (local area network). No big deal either way.
>Did I forget any?
>de WB4APR, Bob
Bill, WA7NWP
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