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PA2AGA > HDDIG 22.06.00 03:29l 187 Lines 6938 Bytes #-9426 (0) @ EU
BID : HD_2000_171G
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Subj: HamDigitalDigest 2000/171G
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Sent: 000621/1820Z @:PI8HGL.#ZH1.NLD.EU #:53646 [Den Haag] FBB $:HD_2000_171G
From: PA2AGA@PI8HGL.#ZH1.NLD.EU
To : HDDIG@EU
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 00 18:52:39 MET
Message-Id: <hd_2000_171G>
From: pa2aga@pe1mvx.ampr.org
To: hd_broadcast@pa2aga.ampr.org
X-BBS-Msg-Type: B
network
> that Hank would lead you to believe once existed.
>
> There are basically three ways we can go from here. One way is to throw up
our
> hands and abandon the idea of amateur radio in the context of digital
networks
> altogether. Most everyone posting here (with a few exceptions) eschews
that
> solution. We all want to do digital radio of one sort or another, and many
of us
> would like to do at least part of that in a networked manner.
>
> A second way is to cling to the past and try to rejuvenate a message
passing
> system that was already an obsolescent concept in the days when it was
> most active (then rail at amateurs because most of us don't want to do
that
> again). That way is a dead horse. It isn't going to come back to life on
any
> sort of major scale.
>
> The third way is to concentrate on what is feasible within the amateur
scope.
> That includes moderate size medium to high speed radio LAN structures. It
> is practical and feasible, albeit a lot of hard work, to build and
maintain packet
> switched radio networks of metropolitan scope, and in some cases of a
> somewhat larger scope, which have a reasonable degree of performance.
> (The biggest amateur network of which I'm aware that meets the criteria
for
> a modern end to end packet switched network spans parts of four states.
> It is pretty much as large as it will ever be because amateurs are too
thin
> on the ground to expand it much further while keeping it coherently linked
> and reliable.)
>
> If there is a need to intertie these networks with other networks (and
there
> often isn't a good reason to do so since a metropolitan scope is often
sufficient
> for amateur purposes), we will need to use whatever means is practically
at
> hand to do that part of the job, because we aren't going to be able to do
it purely
> by amateur radio. We're too thin on the ground, and don't have the
financing or
> the number of skilled amateurs to put up and maintain the necessary
infrastructure
> for a pure radio packet switched digital network on a national or
international scope.
>
> (It is possible that we can do something that is very low speed, and/or
very high
> latency, on a large scale. That sort of network might fill some useful
niche. But
> we aren't even in your wildest dreams going to construct a viable
alternative to
> the wired internet on a large scale. There are too many miles and too few
> amateurs.)
>
> This is all fairly old ground. It has been chewed over here and elsewhere
> many times, often in much greater detail. I found myself alternately
chuckling
> and grimacing while reading some of your suggestions. You haven't been
there
> yet, but a number of us have trod that ground, and in many cases found out
> the hard way what works and what doesn't in the amateur radio context.
>
> Most of the technical issues have viable solutions, though those solutions
> are often very different from what works in the wired world because radio
> propagation in the real world is very different from a wire. It is the
demographic,
> geographic, economic, and political issues that are the hard problems. For
> example, give a thought to the fact that most amateurs reside in the
metropolitan
> areas, and there are wide expanses between metropolitan areas where there
is
> little or no amateur presence.
>
> Who is going to acquire the sites, build, and more importantly who is
going
> to maintain, the links needed to cross those expanses? It isn't feasible
to expect
> amateurs to drive for hours, time and again, year after year, to maintain
a link
> out in the middle of nowhere. (Some of us did it back in the beginning,
but it burned
> virtually all of us out in the end.) Amateurs have lives and other
obligations. The
> reality is, if you don't have a local presence, you can't maintain a
reliable link site
> of even medium performance over the long term.
>
> That means there are going to be many situations where you just can't get
> there from here via packet radio, because the necessary links in between
> either don't exist, or are down. (HF isn't a viable alternative, it is too
slow
> to handle the sort of volume a metropolitan intertie, much less a national
> or international trunk, would be called upon to support.)
>
> If we scale our expectations to the feasible, there is still a lot we can
do with
> amateur radio digital networks that's desirable enough to attract a
sufficient
> following to support it. But don't be fooled, national and international
scope
> amateur radio packet switched networks aren't part of the picture.
>
> Gary
> Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net
> 534 Shannon Way | We break it |
> Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed |
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 12:10:02 GMT
From: Den <dennis.spiess@reckitt.com>
Subject: PSK31 for FD??
In article <20000616232830.14786.00000566@ng-ff1.aol.com>,
ebruchac@aol.comnojunkma (Ed Bruchac ) wrote:
> Anyone planning on running PSK31 for Field Day next weekend? Any
suggestions
> for best band to work?
>
> "I believe in equality for everyone, except reporters and
photographers."
> Gandhi
>
>
Yes, we, W2SE. (10-70 Repeater Association, NNJ) will be running a
digital station on PSK-31 and RTTY for the entire contest. It will be
on what ever band that there is activity. Most likely 20M during the
day, but 10 and 15 will be watched. And 40 at night.
At this time we are only planning one station on digital so it will
roam about the bands.
The software will be TrueTTY as it does both modes.
73
Den Spiess W2DEN
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 18:43:15 -0400
From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." <jshaffer@mail.csrlink.net>
Subject: questions about digital signals on HF
Are there any web pages where I could listen to samples of the various digital
signals I hear on HF? (I'm already familiar with fax and sstv.)
Are there any programs available to decode any of them with a PC soundcard
(aside from the two mentioned above)?
Is there anything worth decoding by anyone other than the intended recipient?
--
"Alan Turing predicted that the idea of machines thinking would be routine
by the end of the century. The very second that time ran out for his
prediction
was the second that computers were set to demonstrate their complete stupidity
because they couldn't add up dates." --Stephen Grand
------------------------------
End of Ham-Digital Digest V2000 #171
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