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ZL3AI > APRDIG 13.04.07 01:27l 252 Lines 9620 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Subj: [APRSSIG] Vol 34 #11, 1/2
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From: ZL3AI@ZL2BAU.#79.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Tiny Trak 3 config? (Bill Vodall WA7NWP)
2. APRS Emergency Preparedness (Robert Bruninga)
3. RE: SSID for RF only Station with backup power ('Scott Miller')
4. RE: SSID for RF only Station with backup power (Robert Bruninga)
5. Tier 2 server question (Jim)
6. Re: APRS Emergency Preparedness (Joel Maslak)
7. Using Overlays creatively (Robert Bruninga)
8. Re: Tier 2 server question (Phillip B. Pacier)
9. RE: Tier 2 server question (Jim)
10. Re: SSID for RF only Station with backup power (John Habbinga)
11. Re: Tier 2 server question (Stephen H. Smith)
12. Re: SSID for RF only Station with backup power (Earl Needham)
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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 10:02:36 -0700
From: "Bill Vodall WA7NWP" <wa7nwp_at_gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [aprssig] Tiny Trak 3 config?
>.. One is beaconing every 30
>seconds for a total of over 100 packets per hour, etc...
>
>Does the Tiny Track have more than one status Text?
TT's have a habit of losing their mind and getting in this beacon crazy
mode. It's a glitch of some sort. Of course that doesn't mean it can't
be misprogrammed.
It should be possible to watch the APRS-IS feed and pick out these stations.
Bill WA7NWP
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:53:54 -0400
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga_at_usna.edu>
Subject: [aprssig] APRS Emergency Preparedness
>All this discussion of special identifiers for stations
>with exceptional UPS capabilities is moot:
>
>In an emergency, when it is most necessary to identify
>such stations, they will be conspicuous by the fact that
>they will be the only stations beaconing anything at all!
I have to respectfully disagree with this philosophy that I have seen now
in several emails here. The purpose of emergency preparedness is to be
prepared before the occurrence of an emergency and to not wait and just see
what happens in an emergency.
The key to emergency preparedness is *practice* and in APRS, the key to
emergency preparedness is to not only -practice-, but also -build- the
network and inform the community. For a statiion that has made special
efforts to be prepared, I think that station should show it on APRS.
That's the fundamental concept of APRS. Preparedness, and local
"situational awareness"... The station symbol is an ideal way to inform
"at-a-glance" the expectations for that station.
Bob, WB4APR
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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 09:21:54 -0700
From: "'Scott Miller'" <scott_at_opentrac.org>
Subject: RE: [aprssig] SSID for RF only Station with backup power
>Are there any low-power digi implememtations that include some telemetry
>capabilities? In a situation of severely reduced resources, it would
>certainly be helpful to know Actual battery state, solar influx, or
>whatever, rather than some capacity claimed months or years
Sure.. it's still in beta testing, but the Tracker2 has built-in
temperature and voltage sensors, and has some extra ADCs and a 1-wire
input.
I think the KPC-3+ can do some simple telemetry, too.
Scott
N1VG
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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 14:05:53 -0400
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga_at_usna.edu>
Subject: RE: [aprssig] SSID for RF only Station with backup power
I'm sorry, but I have to respond to some more sentences I have seen on this
thread. These are taken out of context and are not necesaarily the exact
intended meaning of the writers... But out of context, they do trigger
concerns at how APRS is often preceived compared to its potential...
Nothing personal at all, but here are my comments on a few of these...
>When mobile, I don't care about anyone but other mobile stations generally.
APRS is not just a vehicle tracking system. But it is great to see that
this station has a 2-way APRS system in his car so that he can see the
situational-awareness around him that APRS provides...
>The reality is that a large number of icons is not useful.
>Does the station move? That's important... sometimes.
>Is it infrastructure or is there a human near it?...
>- that's important but is impossible to determine from
>the current use of icons.
Actually, the original APRS symbols going back to 1993 do have a lot of
important attributes. The problem is that these 11 or so attributes are
not displayed on many APRS clones. Even the human activity bit is defined,
but not implemented or displayed in many programs. Someone looking at a
map can select "active stations only" and only those stations with an
operator present will be displayed for a quick assessment of communications
capabilities. See the attributes that are supposed to be displayed on an
APRS symbol on the map:
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/aprs/symbols.html
>The other problem is that we could have 60,000 icons and
>... thus most programs will end up supporting incompatible
>subsets of available icons.
That is why we introduced the OVERLAY system back in 1996. This requires
NO symbol updates or any software changes. The Overlay character allows
any one of a number of basic SYMBOL types to display overlay characters.
Using these symbols and overlays, over 540 different "symbols" can be
displayed for all of these basic symbol types without ANY updates to any
software: CARS, BOATS, TRUCKS, CIRCLES, SQUARES, TRIANGLES, STARS, NWS,
AIRCRAFT, WX, ARRL, CIVIL DEFENSE, BOXES, VANS, SHELTERS.
The problem is some APRS clones that never fully implemented overlays in
the first place. If they supported OVERLAYS on all symbols as was
originally intended, then we could be adding an additional 500 or so new
symbols -and- be using now, up to 2100 unique symbol combinations again,
without any "symbol updates or obsolescence".
So I strongly encourage all software to properly display overlays to give
APRS the flexibility that was intended. Then we can focus on the best
basic symbol types to add as needed.
WB4APR, Bob
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 19:11:58 +0100
From: "Jim" <jim_at_stuckinthemud.org>
Subject: [aprssig] Tier 2 server question
This is a question for those with detailed knowledge of the Tier 2 APERS
servers.
How fast does the information get passed between the servers.
If I gate a position on to one server, are few talking a couple of seconds,
10's of seconds or into a minute or two for the information to be seen on
others?
Jim, G1HUL
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Message: 6
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:40:08 -0600
From: Joel Maslak <jmaslak-aprs_at_antelope.net>
Subject: Re: [aprssig] APRS Emergency Preparedness
On Apr 10, 2007, at 10:53 AM, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>That's the fundamental concept of APRS. Preparedness, and local
>"situational awareness"... The station symbol is an ideal way
>to inform "at-a-glance" the expectations for that station.
Is there a symbol for a well-constructed, reliable station that shows
good amateur practice? Maybe we need one. Of course I only think
two stations (probably not mine) would meet that requirement. Hi hi
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 14:23:12 -0400
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga_at_usna.edu>
Subject: [aprssig] Using Overlays creatively
>I sure wish all APRS programs supported OVERLAYS on ALL SYMBOLS!
>
>The APRS symbol spec found at your website seems to imply
>that only around 10 symbols have support for overlay by
>showing a GPSxyz with a "#" in the "z column". Is that in
>error or am I just misreading the document? MJ
You are correct, but it's 15. Again, the original APRS concept was
overlays on all symbols. But as we moved from the original APRSdos into a
published SPEC we could not get agreement on all symbols and so only a
subset was included in the spec. It kinda made sense, since the base
symbol had to be big enough and have a clear area in its center for the
overlay character to be visible....
But those 15 existing overlayable symbols do offer as many as 540 different
combinations to be used. Too bad some programs don't display them. I
answered your email on the APRSSIG in case others have this same question.
Kenwood solved the overlay problem by displaying it in the upper corner of
a SYMBOL field so that it can apply to any symbol.
When we first came up with overlays, the classic example was to have all of
these Numbered and Lettered CAR and TRUCK symbols so that CALLSIGNS could
be turned off on maps with dozens of vehicles all Closely clustered at a
special event. The OVERLAY made it easy to distinguish every mobile
uniquely without all the map clutter of all those callsigns.
Bob
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:21:28 -0700
From: "Phillip B. Pacier" <ad6nh_at_arrl.net>
Subject: Re: [aprssig] Tier 2 server question
Jim wrote:
>This is a question for those with detailed knowledge of the Tier 2
>APERS servers.
>
>How fast does the information get passed between the servers.
>
>If I gate a position on to one server, are few talking a couple of
>seconds, 10's of seconds or into a minute or two for the information
>to be seen on others?
It's a function of the internet path between the servers. This can
generally be measured in milliseconds to perhaps a second or two, depending
on the number of hops between the servers in question. There is virtually
no measurable processing time within the server itself to turn a packet
around.
73
Phil Pacier - AD6NH
Tier 2 Coordinator
www.aprs2.net
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