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ZL3AI > APRDIG 08.06.03 11:07l 255 Lines 9549 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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From: ZL3AI@ZL3VML.#80.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Subject: Re: Air emergency?
From: "Curt Mills, WE7U" <hacker@tc.fluke.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:25:02 -0700 (PDT)
X-Message-Number: 19
On Tue, 3 Jun 2003, Dakota Summerhawk wrote:
>Most of
>the training that I have seen has stated that equipment capable of using
>this beacon (be it man down alarm, emergency beacon, etc) should be used
>only when YOUR life is in danger. But then that is coming from a
>firefighter/EMT training as well.
There was another story that seemed like a reasonable use of EMERGENCY: A
ham was first on scene at an injury car accident out in the boonies. He
tried getting out on voice repeaters and/or cell-phone, but couldn't reach
anyone. He switched his MIC-E unit in his vehicle to EMERGENCY and it
wasn't long before a state trooper showed up on scene. The trooper asked
him if his name was XX YY. Seems lots of people in several nearby states
saw his beacon and summoned the police to that location, which was exactly
what was needed.
I probably got some of the details wrong, but that's the gist of it. He set
the unit, jumped out of his vehicle and went to help the injured.
If any lives/property are in immediate danger, then emergency is ok. It's
stated in the FCC rules that any use of radio to call for help in these
cases is ok too, licensed or not. I suppose I would weigh carefully
whether to use emergency methods in cases of possible property damage, but
there's not much gray area if human lives are in danger.
--
Curt Mills, WE7U hacker_NO_SPAM_@tc.fluke.com
Senior Methods Engineer/SysAdmin
"Lotto: A tax on people who are bad at math!"
"Windows: Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates!" -- WE7U
"The world DOES revolve around me: I picked the coordinate system!"
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Subject: Re: Air emergency?]
From: Tad Burnett <tburnett@vermontel.net>
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:03:45 -0400
X-Message-Number: 20
Maybe the problem is that there is 2 parts to the "Emergency"...
The "Mayday" part and the emergency people responding...
In the physical world the emergency people have lights and
sirens to say that they are responding and laws to keep
the spectators out of their way....
Perhaps that is what is needed here...Two emergency
signals...
Tad N1QAG
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Subject: Re: Air emergency?]
From: "Mike Yetsko" <myetsko@insydesw.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:18:48 -0400
X-Message-Number: 21
>Maybe the problem is that there is 2 parts to the "Emergency"...
>The "Mayday" part and the emergency people responding...
>In the physical world the emergency people have lights and
>sirens to say that they are responding and laws to keep
>the spectators out of their way....
>Perhaps that is what is needed here...Two emergency
>signals...
I'm sorry, but I really have trouble understanding why a responder to an
event needs an 'emergency' flag.
Unless, of course, it's to just show off...
Seriously, even if a responder in a SAR event found the lost parties, I
don't see an 'Emergency' flag as justified, unless other means of
communication are out. It just clouds the issue.
What if a real, third party, developed a real emergency nearby? They could
get lost in the noise.
To me, letting participants use an emergency flag is like telling cops they
are justified in calling in on the 911 recorded line to report their status
on a call.
Give helpers a group flag or special designation, but NO WAY give them
anything even remotely like 'Emergency'.
Mike
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Subject: Re: Air emergency?]
From: Tad Burnett <tburnett@vermontel.net>
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:49:05 -0400
X-Message-Number: 22
>I'm sorry, but I really have trouble understanding why a responder
>to an event needs an 'emergency' flag.
Well..In this part of the country, Vermont, where APRS is practly
nonexistant, and the emergency workers are volenteers and the 1st responder
is often alone in his vehicle when he comes upon a house fire or someone
fallen through the thin ice or hanging over a rock ledge and proceeds to
put his life on the line and no body else knows exactly where he is other
than what he gets through on chan 9, 11 meters....
Just my thoughts..
Tad N1QAG
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Subject: Re: Air emergency?]
From: "Joe Della Barba" <joe@dellabarba.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:57:11 -0400
X-Message-Number: 23
This guy in this example is not a "responder", he is a "finder". When he
gets his message across and the rest of the volunteers show up they don't
ALL need to beacon EMERGENCY.
73
Joe N3HGB
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Subject: Re: Air emergency?
<LYR18439-135503-2003.06.03-13.57.07--rsnyder#toontown.erial.nj.us@lists.tapr.o>
rg
From: rsnyder@toontown.erial.nj.us (Bob Snyder)
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:55:26 -0400
X-Message-Number: 24
On Tue, Jun 03, 2003 at 02:03:45PM -0400, Tad Burnett wrote:
>In the physical world the emergency people have lights and
>sirens to say that they are responding and laws to keep
>the spectators out of their way....
>Perhaps that is what is needed here...Two emergency
>signals...
That's what alternate nets and tactical calls are for. You can ignore
all the other stations and clearly identify who's filling what role.
Bob N2KGO
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Subject: Re: Questions to the group
From: Ron <n0pom@cox.net>
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:45:27 -0500
X-Message-Number: 25
>>Secondly, I have a newer DELL laptop that I would like to use for APRS.
>> Hard as I try, I cannot get my KPC3 to work on the Com Port.
Ok group, I did get some replies from WA8LMF and others but I am still
not gaining any ground. So let's take this one step at a time and try and
narrow the response.
My laptop is a Dell Inspiron 2500. 900mhz running Win ME (yeah I know some
say its' unstable...but it came with the LT) I know my KPC3 and PK12 both work.
I know the serial cable is good.
Not even trying to use APRS yet, just to narrow the problem of he TNC not
talking to Com1. I know that Com1 works because I have hooked my Garmin 12
to it and it works fine. But for some reason the TNC's will not
communicate. Thought perhaps maybe the fact that PacTerm is a DOS program
it was not making the backard compatible trip and keeping contact with
Com1. So I downloaded a demo version of PacTerm 1.71 for Win and it was not
able to find the TNC either. I hook the same cable/tnc to my old Dell P133
laptop and it takes right off. I could use that for APRS but it is slow and
does not have a built in CD drive.
So, first Question, Does anyone else own a Dell Inspiron or similar that
has had the same problem and if you fixed it how? I call DELL and get
connected to someone in a desert somewhere whom I can barely understand the
broken English much less try and explain what a TNC is/does.
73
Ron Clark N0POM
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Subject: Re: Questions to the group
From: "Joe Della Barba" <joe@dellabarba.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 16:06:37 -0400
X-Message-Number: 26
Try HyperTerminal. If that works, then it is a software issue.
73
Joe N3HGB
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Subject: Re: Questions to the group
From: "Gregg G. Wonderly" <gregg@skymaster.cytetech.com>
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:09:03 -0500
X-Message-Number: 27
Ron, I have not followed this topic. Has anyone suggested that perhaps the
laptop is sending out TTL level signals and the TNC is demanding true RS232
at +-12 volts? It sounds like the port is okay from a receive perspective,
if you can get data from your GPS. Does transmit out of the port work? If
you put a null modem connector on and use the serial cable between both
laptops, can you type text on each and see it appear on the screen of the
other?
-----
gregg@cytetech.com (Cyte Technologies Inc)
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Subject: Re: Air emergency?]
From: "Mike Yetsko" <myetsko@insydesw.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 16:29:18 -0400
X-Message-Number: 28
>>I'm sorry, but I really have trouble understanding why a responder
>>to an event needs an 'emergency' flag.
>>
>Well..In this part of the country, Vermont, where APRS is practly
>nonexistant,
>and the emergency workers are volenteers and the 1st responder is often
>alone in his vehicle when he comes upon a house fire or someone fallen
>through the thin ice or hanging over a rock ledge and proceeds to put his
>life on the line and no body else knows exactly where he is other than
>what he gets through on chan 9, 11 meters....
>
>Just my thoughts..
>Tad N1QAG
So you're saying the first person on scene should drop everything and rush
in and depend on his 'Emergency' status flag to bring help?
Come on...
Oh, I may not be from VT, but I am close by. I fail to see what being
from VT has to do with the situation.
Hmm, come to think of it, if 'I' were in charge of an SAR operation, and I
had lone searchers doing what you propose, I'd boot them off the team
IMMEDIATELY! That's unsafe and reckless. A very quick method for having
MORE people in trouble than just the original people in peril!
Mike
N1DVJ
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