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ZL3AI > APRDIG 03.02.07 01:25l 239 Lines 8992 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Subj: [APRSSIG] Vol 31 #36, 1/3
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From: ZL3AI@ZL2BAU.#79.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Chris Kantarjiev)
2. Level 4 Routing ? (William McKeehan)
3. RE: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Robert Bruninga)
4. RE: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Chris Howard)
5. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Jan T. Pharo)
6. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (A.J. Farmer (AJ3U))
7. RE: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Robert Bruninga)
8. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Steve Huston)
9. RE: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Chris Howard)
10. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (A.J. Farmer (AJ3U))
11. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (A.J. Farmer (AJ3U))
12. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Steve Huston)
13. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (A.J. Farmer (AJ3U))
14. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Steve Huston)
15. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (William McKeehan)
16. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (A.J. Farmer (AJ3U))
17. Re: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Jan T. Pharo)
18. RE: Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects (Robert Bruninga)
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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:10:23 -0800 (PST)
From: Chris Kantarjiev <cak_at_dimebank.com>
Subject: Re: [aprssig] Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects
Bob,
Just to be clear, I think that your new web page
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/localinfo.html
is telling me that our W6WGZ-RPT object is not set up the way you would
prefer. We have the frequency in the description text, but not as the
object name...
73 de chris K6DBG
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:29:21 -0500 (EST)
From: "William McKeehan" <mckeehan_at_mckeehan.homeip.net>
Subject: [aprssig] Level 4 Routing ?
Today I was doing some research on digipeaters. In doing that I read Bob's
doc: http://eng.usna.navy.mil/~bruninga/APRS-docs/DIGIS.TXT
At the bottom is a section that I found very interesting:
---------------------------------------------------------
ORIGINAL LEVEL FOUR NETWORK CONSIDERATIONS:
These concepts were proposed in the early days of APRS (1994) but have
never caught on... THey are retained here for historical purposes.
Since NODES are smarter than digipeating, the ultimate we should have NODES
do all UI frame routing via high speed backbones. The APRS station simply
sends his UI frame TO APRS VIA HOME; Any NODE hearing that transmission
that has knowledge of the route to HOME, will send the single packet via
the NODE network (level 4) to the HOME node! When it arrives at the HOME
node, it is transmitted once as a UI frame. With this arrangement, a mobile
only has to specify his one intended destination, no matter where he
travels! In this example I use the DIGI call of HOME just to represent the
digi near someone's HOME...
DIGI/NODE COMPATIBILITY: Mobiles should be able to specify a path that is
compatible with both nodes and digipeaters. The nodes should only look at
the LAST digi field in an UNPROTO list for the final NODE destination. Any
preceeding fields are assumed to be DIGI's only. This way a path of APRS
VIA WIDE,HOME would be repeated by any WIDE that heard it, but any level 4
node that heard it would forward it to the HOME NODE. If only one field is
included in the digipeater string, it would be interpreted as both a digi
and a HOME destination without any difficulty. Digi's and NODEs would
digipeat it, and nodes (hearing it direct) would forward it at level-4.
---------------------------------------------------------
What would it take for this to be implemented?
Can current day (new paradigm WIDEn-N) digis be upgraded to be a NODE while
remaining a DIGI with the NODE routing overriding the DIGI routing?
--
William McKeehan
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:56:52 -0500
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga_at_usna.edu>
Subject: RE: [aprssig] Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects
>Just to be clear, I think that your new web page
>http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/localinfo.html
>
>is telling me that our W6WGZ-RPT object is not set up
>the way you would prefer. We have the frequency in the
>description text, but not as the object name...
Yes, using the callsign of a voice repeater requires the mobile operator to
have to "look-up" the frequency by pressing some buttons. Whereas if the
frequency is used as the object name, then not only is it immediately
obvious that it is a voice repeater and what the frequency is, but this can
show up on the front panel of the radio hands-free.
It shows up as a 10 second flash when the object comes in, or the mobile
operator can drive along with his station LIST already displayed, and then
the last 5 stations and objects heard will show up, and since that is where
the frequency is best seen.
Your format of:
W6WGZ-RPT>APX:!3717.55N/11941.04Wr 147.180+ PL146.2 w6wgz.org
Will show better as:
147.180+>APOBJ:!3717.55N/11941.04Wr PL 146.2 w6wgz.org
If you want it to be globally unique, then add a character to the end of
the frequency as in 147.180+X where X is unique to your repeater. Since
your repeater does not end in .005 KHz, you actually have two follow bytes
you could use if they made more sense as in 147.18+DC (if for example it
was in washington DC, etc)... Or you could drop the + since it is obvious
and make it 147.18MSP if it was in minneapolis-Saint Paul etc...
Thanks,
Bob, WB4APR
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:12:39 -0700
From: Chris Howard <w0ep_at_frii.com>
Subject: RE: [aprssig] Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects
On Tue, 2007-01-30 at 11:56, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>Will show better as:
>147.180+>APOBJ:!3717.55N/11941.04Wr PL 146.2 w6wgz.org
>
>If you want it to be globally unique, then add a character to
>the end of the frequency as in 147.180+X where X is unique to
>your repeater. Since your repeater does not end in.005 KHz,
>you actually have two follow bytes you could use if they made
>more sense as in 147.18+DC (if for example it was in washington
>DC, etc)... Or you could drop the + since it is obvious and
>make it 147.18MSP if it was in minneapolis-Saint Paul etc...
>
>Thanks,
>Bob, WB4APR
As a computer database type guy...
I don't think I would count on the repeater frequency plus one character
as being a globally unique string.
How many .34-.94 repeaters are there in the world?
just a thought
Chris
w0ep
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:42:59 +0100
From: "Jan T. Pharo" <la2bba_at_jpharo.net>
Subject: Re: [aprssig] Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects
Chris Howard <w0ep_at_frii.com>, Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:12:39 -0700:
>How many.34-.94 repeaters are there in the world?
They all are in region 2.
We others have a different segment and different spacing.
--
73 de Jan, LA2BBA
Hvaler, Norway
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 18:29:43 -0500
From: "A.J. Farmer (AJ3U)" <farmer.aj_at_gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [aprssig] Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects
On 1/30/07, Chris Howard <w0ep_at_frii.com> wrote:
>As a computer database type guy...
>I don't think I would count on the repeater frequency plus one character
>as being a globally unique string.
Why would this matter? According to the spec Bob is proposing, these
objects would be put on the network via one hop to keep them local. There
should not be any conflicts.
--
A.J. Farmer, AJ3U
http://www.aj3u.com
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 19:13:49 -0500
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga_at_usna.edu>
Subject: RE: [aprssig] Local Traveler Repeater Freq Objects
>>As a computer database type guy...
>>I don't think I would count on the repeater frequency
>>plus one character as being a globally unique string.
True, it is not absolutely global, but for the purpose of these objects
which is local RF only anyway, it just doesn't matter to the application.
But to those purests, that want their object to be unique on the APRS-IS,
we offer them a chance to coordinate their -X if they want the hassle...
>Why would this matter?... these objects would be put
>on the network via one hop to keep them local.
>There should not be any conflicts.
Ah... No, not even one hop. DIRECT ONLY. When these objects are
originated at the DIGI as they should be, they should only go DIRECT. (no
hops) If they are digipeated one hop, then they go into surrounding areas
where users cannot possibly use the original voice repeater, and these
distant objects them become SPAM that kills this whole concept.
Also by being originated DIRECT at the DIGI only, they also are fully
protected form QRMing anyone, since the digi only originates one of these
when it hears the channel is clear. If one hop is used, then this is just
another potential QRM source.
Bob, Wb4APR
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