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ZL3AI > APRDIG 25.05.03 10:07l 257 Lines 9156 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Subj: TAPR Digest, May 22, 2/7
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From: ZL3AI@ZL3VML.#80.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Subject: Re: Voice Alert
From: Dave Kaplan <dkaplan@steffeninc.com>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 07:56:45 -0500
X-Message-Number: 11
Apparently you have missed the entire concept by coming into the
conversation in the middle. Setting receive tone to 100hz:
1. Does not effect the ability of the D700A/D7A to decode as the TNC is
before the decode circuit
2. You do not hear the "constant irritation of hearing packet traffic"
since it is transmitted without the 100hz tone.
3. Is a great idea for better utilization of a radio and frequency already
allocated.
Dave
WB0WNX
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Subject: Voice Alert
From: Robbie <mwrobertson@attbi.com>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:09:21 -0500
X-Message-Number: 12
I am confused by the confusion of what Bob is suggesting..
Only the mobile stations that are Voice Alert capable will ever HEAR
all the racket of another Voice Alert mobile. I have yet to hear
another mobile's packet break my Tone Squelch here in the Chicagoland
area, :-) Yes, I have both the D7 and D700 on Tone Squelch.
IF your aprs transceiver doesn't have Tone Squelch, don't turn on your
Tone on transmit either. Then leave your volume control off or down
however you want it.
The nice thing about leaving the volume up without Tone Squelch, is to
get an idea if and when you get digipeated out on the open highway.
If I heard a braaap, and didn't catch the callsign on the screen, I
would just simply say "QRZ, 146.52 please!"
Robbie, wa9inf
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Subject: D7 going into NOCALL
From: "Randy" <wa2age@inreach.com>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:31:54 -0700
X-Message-Number: 13
HI,
My D7 will automatically drop using my callsign and starting senting out
NOCALL.
I checked on FindU this morning, and brought up the page of closest
stations. Again, there was NOCALL sitting in my driveway.
I check the call, before re-cycle power, and my call was still being shown.
I re-cycle power and my call is brought back. The radio is powered from the
car battery.
Anyone have an idea why my D7 decides to start using NOCALL?
Randy
WA2AGE-7
NOCALL
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Subject: Re: Voice Alert on 144.39
From: "Gregg G. Wonderly" <gregg@skymaster.cytetech.com>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:34:29 -0500
X-Message-Number: 14
>Bob Bruninga wrote:
>
>>But the bottom line is that I think the philosophy of your post
>>prevents much more meaningful real-time tactical useful communications
>>than any possible use of Voice Alert would.
>
>The point (there was no philosophy, merely an opposition to a concept)
>of my post was to not introduce, and encourage, interference on the APRS
>data stream on 144.39 by a different type of service. I find it rather
>ironic that the "father of APRS" disagrees with me on this. Such is life
>I guess.
In the world of distributed systems and networks, it is common practice to
plan for failure, and to make the system robust in spite of that failure.
If you are expecting APRS to work 100% of the time, no matter what others
are doing on the frequency, then your expections will not be met. Voice
alert is no different than a transmitter sending a packet at the exact same
time as you do. In this case, CSMA fails because neither station could see
the others carrier, and the biggest gun wins.
There needs to be a recognition of this fact, and a realization that the
world of RF can not be perfect. If you are out on the open road, you are
not going to interfere with much of anything. If you are in the city, you
might cause the digi to not hear a packet. This is not intentional
interference. Intentional includes the desire to interfere with the
operation of other stations. Because you can not hear those other
stations, it will be impossible for you to make a decision that is
accurate. Your TNC has the same problem, and interferes regularly with
other packets, especially when you are driving around town at 30+ watts,
and all the 5watt stations are invisible to the digi while you are
transmitting. A station using 30+ watts on APRS in an area where 5 watts
would work, is interfering with the normal operation of the network. Is it
intentional interference, or was the operator just forgetful, or
neglectful?
I don't think its productive to drag this discussion out, waiting for
everyone to be on the same side...
-----
gregg@cytetech.com (Cyte Technologies Inc)
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Subject: Re: Voice Alert on 144.39
From: Alex <kr1st@amsat.org>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 10:49:16 -0400
X-Message-Number: 15
"Gregg G. Wonderly" wrote:
>I don't think its productive to drag this discussion out, waiting for everyone
>to be on the same side...
Thanks for dragging the discussion out a bit longer, Gregg. You're
right, it's not productive.
73,
--Alex KR1ST (stopped discussing the subject at hand at
1:47pm......yesterday.)
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Subject: Oops
From: Alex <kr1st@amsat.org>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 11:09:27 -0400
X-Message-Number: 16
Should've been off-list. Hit reply-all and deleted wrong addy after
realizing hitting wrong button.
73,
--Alex KR1ST (waiting for buttons to hit back)
Alex wrote:
>You're
>right, it's not productive.
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Subject: Re: WinAprs/Precision Mapping 5.0
From: Mark Sproul <msproul@jove.rutgers.edu>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:06:28 -0400
X-Message-Number: 17
All of the OCX files can be found on http://www.winaprs.org/downloads
Mark
------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Sproul |
http://ecs.rutgers.edu |
msproul@jove.rutgers.edu |
Manager - Engineering Computing Services | 732-445-3121
Rutgers University School of Engineering |
Eng D111 |
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Subject: Re: Voice Alert on 144.39
From: Bob Bruninga <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:34:15 -0400 (EDT)
X-Message-Number: 18
Another observation about Voice Alert, is to make sure that you have your
mobile DIGI OFF. I drove through a big city and was near a voice-alert
mobile, but I was hearing lots of packets because his mobile was acting as
a digi.
Two problems here:
1) Mobiles should not normally be digis except under rare circumstances
2) If they are acting as a digi, they MUST have voice-alert OFF so that
they dont digipeat everything with their PL 100 and drive others nuts.
Bob
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Subject: Re: Voice Alert on 144.39
From: Bob Bruninga <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:42:04 -0400 (EDT)
X-Message-Number: 19
>wanna bet that this thread does more to raise people's awareness of
>voice alert than Bob telling people about it for 2 years?
THis morning I didnt do my normal commute and ran into 4 other Voice
Alert mobiles going into Wash DC. (normally I hear only 1)
1) Had his volume down (I finally found him on a distant repeater)
2) Another thought he had his volume up, but could not hear me. Donno
why. (I could hear him) He saw me and found me on my repeater
3) Another using a D7 had his volume down. I found him on his repeater.
4) A third was out of range, but we could not see him on any of our maps
even though he swears his setup looks "right".. He could see me on his
GPS and gave me street level turning directions to get around a totally
gridlocked commuter route. We never figured out why he wasnt transmitting
his posit.
Eventually #1 did something and got his radio right. He was the only one
that we actually exchanged Voice Alerts..
So, just being aware of it is only 20% of the process. Knowing how to
use it, having it set up, and avoiding Murphy's law is the other 80%...
<grin>
Bob
PCsat WEB page http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/pcsat.html
ISS-APRS FAQ: http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/iss-faq.html
CUBESAT Designs http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/cubesat.html
APRS LIVE pages http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/aprs.html
APRS SATELLITES http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/astars.html
MIM/Mic-E/Mic-Lite http://ssdl.stanford.edu/mims/
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Subject: Re: Voice Alert on 144.39
From: Bob Bruninga <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:44:15 -0400 (EDT)
X-Message-Number: 20
Demetre,
I was told that my choice of PL 100 was a poor choice for Europe that uses
50Hz power mains. If this is the case, then maybe Europe should choose
another PL tone? But if your squelch has not heard anyone, or any noise,
then I guess that means that 50Hz power buzz does not cause a problem?
Let us konw.
Thanks
Bob
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