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ZL3AI > APRDIG 12.05.04 10:19l 279 Lines 10704 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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From: ZL3AI@ZL3VML.#80.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Subject: Re: Help with a Trace
From: "Dennis Hudson, N2LBT" <n2lbt@n2lbt.com>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:28:50 -0400
X-Message-Number: 19
>VE2MUD>TU3P3P,VE2RTS-3*,WIDE,WIDE,TRACE,qAS,VE2ETS:'f1ql#/j/]"4N}Mike
>
>VE2MUD is me naturally.
>
>Ihave no idea what TU3P3P is, can someone clarify this for me....
Mic-e speak from the D700. This is normal, it's used to convey part of the
compressed packet you see at the end. That's about as much as I know, it's
sort of like staring at the Matrix.
>I'm guessing VE2RTS-3 was used as a RELAY?
Yes, and the star after it means that is the digi that was last heard when
your packet was received by the internet. The tailing WIDE, WIDE, TRACE
only cause severe QRM to the channel, and probably the Toronto, Ottawa, and
Quebec, not to mention VT, NH, NY and MA
If you can reliably hit the VE2RTS-3 digi a nice path for you might be
VE2RTS-3, WIDE or maybe just VE2RTS-3, assuming your goal is to have your
wx data archived at findu or aprsworld.
>qAS???????
the Q construct was developed to track where packets come in from RF to the
internet. VE2ETS is the iGate that brought the packet to the internet to be
stored and viewed by either findu or aprsworld.
>And VE2ETS is probably the wide.
No, your area does not need even a fraction of path you're using. While
mobile in my area I use a single path of KA2QYE-10. If I travel north to
Plattsburg or Burlington I might use RELAY, WIDE. This will get me to an
igate, and allow me to use the internet to relay messages for me 90+% of
the time.
>The reason why I'm trying to figure this out is to determine which
>direction to point the antenna.
>For this test I was using my D700 with a whip.
Looks like you'll be all set with just an omni. You could argue one way or
the other, but having an omni can help avoid hidden transmitter syndrome,
loosing packets as a result. I travel a bit in that area and anywhere
around Mont Real you are all set with mobile path of RELAY,WIDE. Traveling
around the Eastern Townships, that's a different story. Coverage is pretty
spotty, but long paths don't help you if you aren't being heard. In fact
theoretically they make it harder to be heard by extending packet length,
making it susceptible to mobile fading.
My thoughts are if you can't make it out of an area on XXXXXX,WIDE2 it's
time for a new igate. Or move to Texas where they have no path rules.
>Thanks for any help in
>decoding the path.
>
>Cheers,
>Mike
--
Dennis Hudson, N2LBT
sysop aprsdaly
Albany, NY
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Subject: Re: Help with a Trace
<LYR36507-196213-2004.04.23-14.13.09--mikejp#videotron.ca@lists.tapr.org>
From: "Michael J. Pawlowsky" <mikep@mikeathome.net>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:34:10 -0400
X-Message-Number: 20
Thanks for the answers Sean and Wes.
Sean... yes I have moved since then. The location of the wx station is 45
30.056N 74 21.540W or I should say within 60' of there ;-)
Believe it or not I've been trying to reach people about this all winter.
I've talked to several club presidents etc. and they were pretty clueless
about APRS. (Sorry Bob)
The worst part is that Amateur Digital Radio (at least as folklore around
here has it) was created in Montreal. They keep talking about that first
demonstartion in a local Montreal restaurant during a HAM meeting.
But Paket Radio has seemed to have lost a lot of it's appeal to many.
Right beside where I am putting the wx station there is a great tower on
the top of a mountain with a "TheNet" digipeater (VE2RM
http://www.securenet.net/members/lfrebour/ve2rm.htm) that I never heard
anyone use. I would love to convince these guys to use it as an APRS
digipeater. But I'm sure that would take quite a bit of convincing since it
was one of the first packet radio repeaters in the area.
Well at least now I have the call of the digipeater in Mercier that I am
hitting so I will try and track these guys down for some suggestion for the
path of the weather station.
Cheers,
Mike
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Subject: Re: Everlasting discussions, Smart Move/Transition?
From: "Scott Miller" <scott@opentrac.org>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:24:11 -0700
X-Message-Number: 21
>Why not just have the PIC check the list every 30 seconds.
>There is not much in APRS that should be that time
>critical that a few seconds would make a difference if
>it added new fundtionality... Bob
Can I quote you on that, Bob? I've gotten blasted before for suggesting
things that would introduce any kind of delay into the system. For
example, aggregating 15 seconds worth of traffic at a digipeater before
retransmission to save TXD overhead.
How much delay IS acceptable in the system? What should the design goal be?
Scott
N1VG
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Subject: Re: Help with a Trace
<LYR36507-196219-2004.04.23-14.40.00--mikejp#videotron.ca@lists.tapr.org>
From: "Michael J. Pawlowsky" <mikep@mikeathome.net>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 15:24:25 -0400
X-Message-Number: 22
I've contacted the club that owns VE2RTS-3 and am simply waiting for their
permission to use VE2RTS-3,WIDE as the path for the wx station. I want to
remain polite and ask permission before I send out a packet every 5 minutes
to them.
As for myself in my car, I've been using RELAY, WIDE, WIDE. (simply because
it was part of an example that I saw on the net when I first started using
APRS). It mentioned appropriate paths for different areas and that was the
one closest to me.
I understand the first relay and the first wide. But I'm not so clear on
what the second wide does. Does the second WIDE mean that the first WIDE
will transmit it again to be picked up by another WIDE? So as long as my
first WIDE is gating it, there's no reason to pass it to the next wide if
all I really want is to get onto the net.
But just so I'm clear about this one... If for instance I wanted you in
Albany to receive my position for whatever reason over the air I would use
something like RELAY, WIDE,WIDE,WIDE (if it needed to go through 3 WIDES to
reach Albany)
Would it be better then to simply have RELAY,WIDE. I basically drive
anywhere between Quebec City, Toronto and NYC. I'm also pretty lazy about
changing the path everytime I go somewhere different and would like to keep
one setting if possible.
>If you can reliably hit the VE2RTS-3 digi a nice path for you might be
>VE2RTS-3, WIDE or maybe just VE2RTS-3, assuming your goal is to have
>your wx data archived at findu or aprsworld.
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Subject: Re: Everlasting discussions, Smart Move/Transition?
From: "AE5PL Lists" <HamLists@ametx.com>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:30:01 -0500
X-Message-Number: 23
Good question, Scott. For the most part, APRS-IS uses a 30 second sliding
window for duplicate elimination. This is to reduce the total number of
packets passed, but more importantly, to reduce the propagation of looped
packets. So, there is one number to work with, 30 seconds.
73,
Pete Loveall AE5PL
pete@ae5pl.net
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Subject: Re: Ambiguity?
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:05:40 -0400
X-Message-Number: 24
>So we're fine with Base-91 positions as ratified in the spec, right?
Wow, how many times to I have to say this over and over...
QUOTE:
The compressed protocol as written in the spec is NOT fully implemented in
many client programs and in my opinion should NOT be uesd by anyone that is
concerned with interoperability with existing client software.
UNQUOTE
Bob
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Subject: Re: Additional thoughts on the great debate....
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:34:23 -0400
X-Message-Number: 25
>>>"Scott Miller" <scott@3xf.com> 4/22/04 10:32:24 PM >>>
>Too late. /A= and {xx} has been in there since 1995.
>Looking for these is trivial. Here is the code in BASIC
>for finding these additions in the C$ Comment string:
IF INSTR(C$,"/A=") THEN (then go do altitude)
IF INSTR(C$, "{") THEN (then go do a sign post)
IF INSTR(C$, "!") THEN (then go do this new precision thing...
>How many people do you think have exclamation points in
>their comments? I'll save you the trouble - at
>the moment, 840 are listed in aprsworld.
You were complaining about the complexity of finding the three formats in
the Comment field. I showed you how. A prudent programmer then goes to the
proper routine and then brings on additional verification code to verify
that the string initiated by that character meets all other criteria.. Good
code should do verificaiton checking of all user in put data...
Bob
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Subject: Re: APRS greater precision
From: "Robert Bruninga" <bruninga@usna.edu>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:51:14 -0400
X-Message-Number: 26
>>>"KC2MMi" <kc2mmi@verizon.net> 4/23/04 >>>
>>Interesting comment from someone who doesnt own one.
>
>Bob? I don't own one? You mean, the one that's two feet
>away from me is acounterfeit?
Oops, sorry my appology. I confused you with someone else who was
complaining as loudly... My error.
>Either the TH-D7 is incredibly poorly documented, or it
>doesn't support very much of what APRS provides for.
True, the Kenwood docs assume tht the person who bought is is a fully
informed APRS user and knows how APRS works and what it is good for and
what it isnt. There is no way to just buy a D7 , read the manual and have
any clue about APRS. I certainly grant you that...
The orignal APRS docs were 2 inches thick when printed out. THey couldnt
stuff all that in the D7 shipping box. Even if they did, nobody would read
it.
>It doesn't support very much of what APRS provides for.
I really dont understand how you can come to that conclusion. Could you be
more specific? Remember it is an HT without a QWERTY Keyboard and without
a PC display. Other than that, it does just about everything in the
APRSspec except for the compressed objects.
>You tell me, if I send compressed posits, where is
>the radio going to display them? We can start from there.
The D7 does not have a MAP display. It assumes you have an attached GPS
with a map display. If you want greater precision than that, then if gives
you a serial port to connect a PC which can do anything you want...
de WB4APR, Bob
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