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ZL3AI > APRDIG 10.05.04 08:14l 290 Lines 9570 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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From: ZL3AI@ZL3VML.#80.NZL.OC
To : APRDIG@WW
Subject: Re: APRS greater precision
From: "Curt, WE7U" <archer@eskimo.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 10:58:45 -0700 (PDT)
X-Message-Number: 42
On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>Thats exactly what APRS did. But it was in error. I wrongly
>assumed that the NMEA data remained in WGS84 even if the
>viewer selected a different datum for dissplay. That was a
>mistake.
>
>I like Roger's suggestion, (since APRS is supposed to be
>a LOCAL thing) is to assume the dataum is the LOCAL
>default unless told otherwise...
I think that would be a big mistake. It'll cause even more confusion. I
think each transmitter should either convert to WGS84, or identify the
datum used. Smarter clients can correct for it, but others will at least
show _some_ position, and the APRS world will be a better place because of
all this.
As the small transmitters get more and more intelligent, they can correct
it to WGS84 on the way out as well, which will make things even better
long-term.
--
Curt, WE7U archer at eskimo dot com
Arlington, WA, USA http://www.eskimo.com/~archer
"Lotto: A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown
"Windows: Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
"The world DOES revolve around me: I picked the coordinate system!"
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Subject: Re: APRS greater precision
From: "Curt, WE7U" <archer@eskimo.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:00:01 -0700 (PDT)
X-Message-Number: 43
On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, Scott Miller wrote:
>Next time, we need to make sure we get a spherical planet. This irregular
>oblate spheroid thing just isn't cutting it.
Yea, but then people would argue over where the prime meridian is...
--
Curt, WE7U archer at eskimo dot com
Arlington, WA, USA http://www.eskimo.com/~archer
"Lotto: A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown
"Windows: Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
"The world DOES revolve around me: I picked the coordinate system!"
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Subject: Re: APRS Kenwood Radios
From: "Bill Vodall WA7NWP" <wa7nwp@jnos.org>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:07:38 -0700
X-Message-Number: 44
>>Kenwood has my support... but they also have my suggestions for making
>>their product better. Provide us a better software tools to talk to the
>>TNC and display.
>
>How about making it possible for end users to install new firmware, or
>even (gasp) open source?
We don't even need that. If the Kenwoods simply worked at KISS packet -
multiple 1K byte packets - and the serial control features were active in
KISS mode, it would be a silver-bullet radio for Amateur packet radio.
There is currently no off the shelf, frequency agile, solution for 9k6...
73,
Bill
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Subject: Re: APRS greater precision
From: "Curt, WE7U" <archer@eskimo.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:14:58 -0700 (PDT)
X-Message-Number: 45
On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, Spider wrote:
>>>>>Jeff King <jeff@aerodata.net> 4/19/04 3:25:57 PM >>>
>>
>>>Every APRS GUI application on the market today,
>>>will display Base91 compressed posits?
>
>Well, which ones do and which ones don't?
>
>Will:
>
>UI-View32
Except for compressed objects/items, right?
>Xastir
I think APRSdos will as well.
>Won't:
>
>Hamhud
>Kenwood
>
>Who else?
>
>Jim, WA6OFT
--
Curt, WE7U archer at eskimo dot com
Arlington, WA, USA http://www.eskimo.com/~archer
"Lotto: A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown
"Windows: Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
"The world DOES revolve around me: I picked the coordinate system!"
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Subject: Re: APRS greater precision
From: "Curt, WE7U" <archer@eskimo.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:17:06 -0700 (PDT)
X-Message-Number: 46
On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, Spider wrote:
>They use NAD27 now but with 'forward' thinking, the trend will be toward
>NAD83 with newer maps.
>And WGS84 for electronic maps. Our paper maps currently are mixed...NAD27
>and NAD83.
You might as well switch to WGS84 instead of NAD83, as the differences are
only apparent to surveyors.
>On a search, it really does not matter as everyone will be briefed and on
>the same page!
We've officially switched to WGS84 for SAR in our county, when reporting
positions. That certainly means it can be a pain for the people in the
field that are using NAD27 maps.
--
Curt, WE7U archer at eskimo dot com
Arlington, WA, USA http://www.eskimo.com/~archer
"Lotto: A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown
"Windows: Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
"The world DOES revolve around me: I picked the coordinate system!"
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Subject: Re: [ui-view] Removal of the UI-View message extensions fromUI-View32
From: John K9IJ <k9ij@vx5.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 13:21:35 -0500
X-Message-Number: 47
At 10:28 AM 4/20/2004 -0700, Curt, WE7U wrote:
>On Sun, 18 Apr 2004, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>
>>Its easy, we have argued over and over on this SIG that
>>it is just plain WRONG to transmit a position with precision
>>to ONE FOOT if the position is NOT known to that accuracy.
>>And to my knowledge NONE of the existin g common mapping
>>programs in use on APRS have anywhere near that kind
>>of precision.
>
>If you're using County GIS Shapefile-format maps (or one of the
>other GIS-format maps we support), you can do that with Xastir.
>
>Would you call Xastir a common mapping program used for APRS yet?
>We're at over 800 downloads/month now, and that doesn't count the
>many advanced users that have figured out that CVS is the way to go,
>so they can skip the big file downloads from now on.
>
>
>>Compressed posit format is in the SPEC for use in special
>>CLOSED systems where you can GUARANTEE that the
>>precision transmitted has that precision, otehrwise you
>>are doing everyone a disservice by transmitting WRONG
>>data.
>
>And relative positions of objects/items is an exception to this
>rule. GPS is not required for this, therefore we don't have to
>stick to GPS resolutions.
Then what you're doing is NOT APRS . You maybe need to start your own SIG
and take this kind of discussion there.
John - K9IJ
-
John Rice K9IJ
k9ij@vx5.com
Webmaster, Network Admin, Janitor
http://www.k9ij.com
http://www.suhfars.org
http://www.vx5.com/~teampf
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Subject: RE: APRS Kenwood Radios
<LYR36507-195018-2004.04.20-13.46.47--mikejp#videotron.ca@lists.tapr.org>
From: "Michael J. Pawlowsky" <mikejp@videotron.ca>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 14:54:41 -0400
X-Message-Number: 48
I'm sure I saw it on here somewhere before but just in case you can add a
folding keyboard to your D700 that makes it quite usable in a vehicle
(parked of course),
For the interface take a look at:
W2FS Kenwood D700 Keyboard Interface Kit
http://www.john.hansen.net/Kenkey.htm
And for a keyboard, there are quite a few but for instance you can take a
look at:
http://www.xpcgear.com/fold2000kb.html
>Ever tried to send any kind of a text message using
>the D-7 keypad or the D-700 mic??? 5 WPM MORSE
>CODE IS FASTER!!!!
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Subject: RE: APRS Kenwood Radios
From: John Hansen <hansen@fredonia.edu>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:19:46 -0400
X-Message-Number: 49
At 10:35 AM 4/20/2004 -0700, Daron J. Wilson wrote:
>>>Ever tried to send any kind of a text message using
>>>the D-7 keypad or the D-700 mic??? 5 WPM MORSE
>>>CODE IS FASTER!!!!
>
>I for one am very glad for this. When bandwidth is limited, using the
>positioning setup to fire worthless messages back and forth frustrates
>me. It should be usable, but if it had a keyboard on there, some of
>these LIDS would be typing paragraphs back and forth while the rest of
>us were trying to see weather and issue position reports.
Maybe not. Based on the sales data here, something like 10% of D700 users
are using a PC keyboard with their radios and that doesn't seem to be the
source of channel congestion.
John W2FS
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Subject: Re: APRS Kenwood Radios
From: Jeff King <jeff@aerodata.net>
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:20:16 -0400
X-Message-Number: 50
On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:56:13 -0400, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>Yep, which is *exactly* why they have resisted the temptation to
>diddle with any upgrades. If they came out with a new radio every
>year that did *anything* different that the old radio could not do,
>then BINGO, angry hams...
>
>>It really does seem ashame ham radio has dropped so far that a
>>vendor is holding back progress.
>
>Duh, wrong planet you're on. Kenwood is holding nothing back.
Yes I know. I was being paradoxical on purpose. Ultimately, it comes down to
the educated choice an individual makes.
As to the rest of the "duh's" as you so eloquently put it, I'm 110% in
agreement with Jim Duncan's post yesterday.
p.s
>And it seems that the most vociferous detractors and complainers
>don't even own one...
I was commenting on the progress, or lack there of of APRS. It was YOU that
presented the Kenwood radios as millstones around the neck of APRSDOM
preventing new protocols. I hardly think I need to own one to see that.
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